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Is Vegan Always Kosher? Veganism is sweeping the nation. Does this trend provide a benefit for the kosher consumer? Can one eat just about anything in a vegan restaurant? On this episode of Let’s Talk Kashrus, Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger is joined by Rabbi Avrohom Weinrib, Rov of Congregation Zichron Eliezer of Cincinnati, Ohio, and Rabbinic Administrator of Cincinnati Kosher, to discuss this fascinating and very relevant contemporary topic. Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger: Thank you, Rabbi Weinrib, for Talking Kosher with us. Rabbi Avrohom Weinrib: What a pleasure! Rabbi Hisiger: We would like to discuss the following fascinating topic: Vegan food is very popular today. May a kosher consumer eat in a vegan restaurant? Rabbi Weinrib: Vegan food is very much in vogue today. Especially in out-of-town places, where there are less kosher-certified restaurants, people may believe that vegan restaurants are a great option. After all, what could be the problem? They don’t have any meat or dairy, so what could be an issue? The truth, however, is that there are many potential kashrus problems. The most obvious problem is infestation in the vegetables. Everyone knows that some vegetables must be checked for insects but many people do not realize how many different vegetables could be problematic. In vegan restaurants, the bulk of the food contains vegetables and many have infestation issues. Rabbi Hisiger: Aren’t there laws on the books that mandate the restaurants to clean the vegetables before serving them? Rabbi Weinrib: Yes, there are. But the laws of the country and the halacha are a million miles apart. They might legally have to wash the vegetables to some extent, and you probably won’t see any bugs crawling around on your plate, but the laws won’t take care of the halachic problems. A thrip, for example, is very small. According to the FDA, a certain number of thrips are permitted. But according to halacha, if someone eats one thrip he has transgressed six lavim d’oraysa. There also can be multiple aphids in the food that are permitted by the law but forbidden by halacha. People need to realize this but, unfortunately, even people in the kashrus industry do not. I recently had an experience that really highlighted this issue. There was a vegan restaurant that was under a certain hashgacha that will remain unnamed. Someone asked me to do a review of this restaurant to see if he could eat there. I went down and saw that there were horrific infestation issues that were not being dealt with. I asked the Mashgiach if anything was done about bugs and he told me, “I make sure that they wash the vegetables.” Obviously, just washing with water will not remove thrips. At best, it might take off some flies. This story illustrates the unfortunate situation that some hashgachos do not understand the infestations issues and are not up to date with the facts. Infestation issues are constantly evolving and changing and we always have to stay on top of it. People claim that it isn’t a big deal because “in the old days people ate everything.” That may be partially because they didn’t know about some of the problems and partially because they used more pesticides in those times that aren’t used today for health reasons. Today, some vegetables are infested much more than in the past. Rabbi Hisiger: So vegan restaurants need a reputable hechsher, just like any other restaurant? Rabbi Weinrib: 100%. Rabbi Hisiger: Are there any other issues besides for vegetable infestation? Rabbi Weinrib: Yes. The second biggest issue is bishul akum. Anything that is prepared and cooked by a non-Jew and is worthy of being served on a king’s table could present a problem of bishul akum. Some foods can be eaten raw and, therefore, are not a problem, but many other dishes cannot be eaten raw. People may not realize that even if all the ingredients are technically kosher, if something is bishul akum it may not be eaten. Rabbi Hisiger: Many people may also not realize that bishul akum could be a problem in their own home if they have domestic help preparing food for them. Rabbi Weinrib: Correct. I once had a very unfortunate story where a fellow called me and said that his cleaning lady had been making the soup for Shabbos in his home for 10 years and he had never been aware that this was a problem of bishul akum. I didn’t have the heart to tell him that he had eaten forbidden soup for a decade. I had to go through all the utensils in his house and determine what needed to be kashered. This was a very frum family but they transgressed a prohibition for 10 years because of a lack of knowledge. People have to be aware that even asking a cleaning lady to cook an egg for a child could be a big problem and, according to some dayos, could render the keilim treif. It could create a disaster in the kitchen. Rabbi Hisiger: Returning to the vegan restaurant, would it be a bigger problem if the owner is Jewish than if he is a non-Jew? Rabbi Weinrib: If the owner is a Jew there could be additional problems if the keilim were not toveled, if challah was not taken or if chometz was not sold over Pesach. Rabbi Hisiger: So is there anything a Jew can buy in a vegan restaurant? Rabbi Weinrib: Even if a product is not a kashrus problem, there is a general issue of maras ayin in entering a restaurant that has no hechsher. The worst kind of maras ayin is when someone enters a “kosher style” restaurant that is actually not kosher. If someone sees a frum Jew who looks like a “rabbi” going into such a place, they may assume it is okay to eat there. A vegan restaurant presents the same problem. If someone who is not so knowledgeable sees a frum Jew going into such a place, they might think it’s okay to eat anything there. For this reason, it is more of a serious maras ayin issue to enter a vegan restaurant than an obviously treif restaurant. Rabbi Hisiger: Do you have any final takeaways for our Let’s Talk Kashrus readers? Rabbi Weinrib: People sometimes get invited to meetings at non-kosher restaurants. Assuming there is no maras ayin problem, they want to know if they can eat plain, cut-up fruit. While this may not seem like a problem, there is an issue of the knife that was used to cut the fruit. In a commercial setting, such as a supermarket, this is less of an issue because the cutting of the fruit is done in a mass production, which the Shulchan Aruch rules is not a problem because any residue on the knife will be batul. One other topic that I’d like to mention briefly is that of party planners. We all have heard stories of party planners operating without a hashgacha. Until recently, I thought this was only relevant for large and fancy events. However, it became relevant to me three months ago when my daughter got engaged. The vort was held in Lakewood and, being from Cincinnati, we needed some help with the planning. One of my siblings told me about a woman who could help put the event together, so we gave her a call. I didn’t think of her as a party planner but, essentially, that’s what she was. I didn’t think anything of it until afterwards when I realized that there had been salads at the vort and I didn’t know where they came from. I hope it was okay but this story conveys why there is a need for awareness to make sure everything is done properly and only the most kadosh things go into our mouths. Rabbi Hisiger: Thank you, Rabbi Weinrib, for your insights and for your contributions to the field of kashrus.

Join Rabbi Daniel Senter, Chief Operating Officer of Kof-K Kosher, and Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger, as they discuss the kashrus status of various species of fish and what you need to know when you go fishing. Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger: Thank you for joining us, Rabbi Senter. Rabbi Daniel Senter: It is my pleasure. Rabbi Hisger: I’d like to tap into your knowledge on the intricacies of kosher fish. If someone goes fishing and catches some fish, how can they know if their catch is kosher? Rabbi Senter: That’s an excellent question. For fish to be kosher, they need to have two simanim - which is really one and the same. They need snapir v’kaskeses, fins and scales. Everything that swims in the water has fins. In fact, the tail itself is actually a fin. The scales are what identifies a fish as kosher. It is not as simple as taking a look and seeing that there are scales because not everything that I’d consider to be scales are actually scales. A scale has to be an armor-like substance on top of the skin that can be removed without tearing the skin. If you catch a fish and want to know if it is kosher, the best ways are if you can see the scales and know how to identify kosher scales, or if you are familiar with this particular species of fish. As an example, there is a common fish that is called a trout. On the trout, you can see clearly where the scales are. The other advantage is that I know that trout are kosher and I know that this is a trout. So, if I go fishing and I catch a trout, being that I know that trout is a kosher species and I know that this is a trout, I can eat that fish. There is actually a fish in the ocean known as a sea trout. It happens to also be kosher but it has no relationship to the standard trout. This shows why you can’t rely on the name alone. You have to be familiar with the particular fish. The trout is a good example of a kosher fish, however it’s not always that clear. There is a fish called the Spanish mackerel. If you look at the skin, it is completely smooth. This is actually a kosher fish. Mackerel is related to tuna, although not closely related. When they come out of the water, they shed their scales. If you caught this fish, most people would say it isn’t a kosher fish. But if you’re familiar with mackerel you would know that it is a kosher fish and it may be eaten. Rabbi Hisiger: Which part of fish do scales have to be on? The entire fish? Rabbi Senter: As long as you find one scale on the fish, it would be good enough. As I said, some fish shed their scales. On those fish, you’ll normally find scales in covered, protected areas of fish. But there are fish where the scales are very obvious. A tilapia is a fish where you can clearly see the scales. Carp is also a common kosher fish that people catch. Those have huge, developed scales. Fish like tilapia and carp are very easy to tell that they are kosher fish. Other fish, like the mackerel, are not as easy. The general rule of thumb would be to know your species. If not, be cautious and ask a question. I don’t mean that you have to ask your Rov if this is a kosher fish. You can ask a fishmonger what species this fish is and he can tell you. There are many lists of common kosher fish available. There are thousands of species of fish. Some of them are kosher and some of them are not. It would be far beyond us to publish a list of all kosher fish but we can publish lists of those that are commonly available. There aren’t that many. If you go to the northeast, there are about 30 or 40 different kinds of fish that are commonly available. If you are familiar with those and know, for example, that a bass is kosher and catfish is not and you know how to identify them, you’ll be able to make the decision yourself about the kashrus status of the fish. Rabbi Hisiger: When a store sells fish under a certain label, can I trust them and assume it really is what they say it is? Rabbi Senter: At one time, when fish was very inexpensive, you were safer doing that. The crazy thing is that fish was always the poor man’s alternative to meat. Today, fish is more expensive than meat, especially certain varieties of fish. As our oceans are overfished, certain species of sought-after and targeted fish become harder to get and, therefore, are commonly switched. A great example of that is sable. Sable was a very popular fish and many people enjoy kosher smoked sable. As it became more expensive, Chilean sea bass was a good alternative because it tastes similar. They are both kosher fish, so it wasn’t a kashrus problem. But it was a Choshen Mishpat shaila people thought they were getting one fish and were getting another. What happened, fortunately or unfortunately, is that Chilean sea bass has caught up to the fish it was being used as a substitute for. So now you’ll probably end up with the right species, identified the right way. Rabbi Hisiger: Do I have to be worried that the company is adding ingredients to the fish? Rabbi Senter: Yes and no. I very often get calls from people who buy fish that say “color added”. These calls are often about salmon. Salmon outsells all other fish in America by about 5 to 1. We eat a lot of salmon. Most of our salmon, though not all of it, is farm raised. How does salmon get its pink or red color? From eating animals in the ocean like shrimp that have beta carotene in them. You will sometimes see on salmon labels that it says “color added to feed”. That sounds like they’re coloring the fish. But what they actually do is feed the fish beta carotene. By law, they have to write “color added”. That would not be a problem. Sometimes, however, they will add seasoning to fish. And when they want to freeze fish, they will sometimes put it in a coating. Very often, the coating is just corn syrup, which would not be a problem other than on Pesach. But one has to be careful. Rabbi Hisiger: Is the coating a preservative? Rabbi Senter: What they want to do is give it a glassy coating. Putting a little bit of corn syrup or a little starch will give fish a nice shiny glaze when they want to freeze it. Seasoned fish would obviously be a problem. In regular fresh, raw fish without anything listed as additives, we haven’t really found a problem of added ingredients. Rabbi Hisiger: Is there a concern that the company may be adding a piece of skin or scales back onto fish? Rabbi Senter: So far, we have only discussed whole fish. Another option is buying fish with the skin on. We’ve gotten used to eating fish without having to be bothered with the bones. The fish is fileted for us, meaning that the meat is taken away from the bones. Sometimes, when a fish is fileted, the skin is also taken off. If the fish has no skin, catfish and tilapia look almost exactly the same. Because of that, fish without skin is not acceptable and would be considered non-kosher. But if the skin of tilapia is left on, it is very identifiable as a kosher fish and that would be enough to buy it. If a company says they will leave the skin on, you can trust them because they sell it by weight and if you pay for the skin, that’s additional money for them. So, you can rely on that. The problem we have created is that we’ve become lazy. People not only do not want bones. They also do not want skin. So companies will take off the skin and just leave one little skin tag in a corner. Theoretically that would be a good siman of kashrus. However, we’ve had cases of frozen fish with skin tags on that look kosher, but if you look closely, you can see that it is only frozen together to the fish a little and not totally attached. Why would a company put a skin tag of a kosher fish on a non-kosher fish? Because catfish only costs about two dollars a pound. It would be a big yeitzer hara for them to substitute it for a more expensive, kosher fish. Rabbi Hisiger: Can the layman tell if the skin tag is from a different fish? Rabbi Senter: If it comes off too easily or it looks like it’s in the wrong place, that’s something you should be concerned about. I wouldn’t say it’s a common problem but one should be careful. More importantly, one has to realize that just seeing skin on a fish doesn’t make it kosher. Non-kosher fish have skin too. There needs to be enough skin to recognize that it is a kosher fish, by checking for scales on the skin tag. Rabbi Hisiger: What is the strangest shaila you’ve ever received in regards to fish? Rabbi Senter: We received a phone call from a very irate customer in a restaurant. He had ordered a sea bass and was served a whole fish on a plate to his table. The fish’s last meal was stuck between its gills. Basically, he was served a fish with a shrimp in its mouth. We had a whole shaila about the keilim, etc. As far as fish are concerned, this was the most bizarre shaila I ever got. Would I tell you that you have to check the mouth of every fish? No. I would say that this was a one-in-a-million case. Rabbi Hisiger: As we try to do in these segments, can you please give us your “Let’s Talk Kashrus” takeaway for the people at home? Rabbi Senter: The takeaway is that before you assume that something is kosher, it is important to know what makes the fish kosher. More importantly, it is upon us to recognize what makes things kosher and not kosher. We tend to rely on everyone else and want to do less ourselves. It’s important for us to learn and know on our own, so that we can take the achrayus of kashrus on ourselves and make sure that whatever ends up on our plates and in our homes is kosher. Rabbi Hisiger: Thank you Rabbi Senter for this educational and entertaining lesson.

Join an insightful conversation between Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger and Rabbi Sholem Fishbane, Director of Kashrus for the Chicago Rabbinical Council, and the Executive Director of AKO, discussing a sticky rice situation that happened at a recent event.

cRc - Chicago Rabbinical Council

Join Rabbi Zalman Krems, Rabbinical Coordinator of KVH-Rabbinical Council of New England and Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger, as they discuss what the traveler on the go needs to know about keeping kosher while on the road, in a wide-ranging conversation covering many food products that a traveling Jew may encounter from fish to nuts. Part 1 Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger: Rabbi Krems, thank you for joining us. Rabbi Zaman Krems: It is my pleasure. Rabbi Hisiger: I am delighted to cover the topic of kashrus on the road because it is so prevalent. It is something that is relevant to traveling businessmen, people who go away for leisure and families on vacation. There are so many applications of this topic. I’d like to start by mentioning that there was a very interesting video circulating recently. It seems that 100,000 or so Israelis traveled to the Sinai for vacation. In the video, we see a fellow named Mohammad who seems quite knowledgeable about kashrus. He is speaking as if he knows the ins and outs of the business and it is evident that someone taught him a few things. This video seems to bring out the point that when it comes to kashrus, you can’t just take someone’s word on it. Rabbi Krems: There are a few videos like that going around. When people are traveling, they are out of their comfort zone. At home, they know what to look for as far as kashrus is concerned. They know their own bakery and grocery store. But once they leave home, they don’t know who they can trust and don’t have the information they need. Some people may sound knowledgeable, but they have nothing behind them. It is very common to find non-Jewish people who maybe once worked for a kosher caterer and now claim that they know all about kosher. This can lead to many problems. Someone told me that he once was on a cruise ship where there was no hashgacha. There were some kosher chickens on board and a non-Jewish staff member said that it was okay to just double wrap them and put them in the treif oven. In truth, there is a way to do that properly and a way to mess it up. If one isn’t aware of the proper way, it could be a big problem. Therefore, even if someone is Jewish and frum, just because he says he knows about kashrus doesn’t mean the end result will be good. Rabbi Hisiger: So how does one know if he can rely on someone and trust him regarding kashrus? Rabbi Krems: There is a concept in halacha of “eid echad neeman b’issurim.” Normally, a Jew who is shomer Torah and mitzvos is trusted. But that person has to know what he’s talking about. Complicated situations can arise because many people don’t necessarily know and even if they do know something about kashrus in their comfort zone, once they leave their hometown or another large Jewish community, they don’t really know how to deal with it. So, the real answer is, that before one travels, he must consult with someone who has information. A person can speak with his own Rov who can be in touch with kashrus professionals that are able to guide people in this area. If the person has contacts that he knows who are kashrus professionals, he can contact them himself. Rabbi Hisiger: If someone goes to one of these programs in a hotel, for Pesach, Shabbos etc, what should he ask? How can he know that everything is kosher l’mehadrin? Rabbi Krems: The first thing to do is to find a program with a reliable hashgacha – meaning one that is generally recommended and well known to be reputable and trusted. A telltale sign of potential problems is if the person giving the hashgacha doesn’t give a hechsher on anything else besides Pesach hotels. That’s a real red flag. Rabbi Hisiger: How many Mashgichim should a Pesach program have? Rabbi Krems: If there are only one or two, there’s no way they can be covering everything properly. For example, that isn’t enough to make sure everything is properly koshered. I heard about one place where they were just making everything “pagum” by pouring bleach everywhere. That is not the normative way of dealing with kashrus issues and not the proper way to do it. Rabbi Hisiger: So, you’re saying that a person should make sure that the hashgacha is reputable and ask questions. Rabbi Krems: You should definitely ask questions. That is the most beneficial thing for kashrus. Even if there is a reliable certification, you should speak to the Mashgiach. The balhabos of the program needs to know that people care about kashrus and aren’t only concerned about enjoying themselves. Rabbi Hisiger: What if someone is on the road and is going into gas stations and hotel lounges. What issues could there be in buying food? Rabbi Krems: Once something leaves its original packaging, it is no longer certified by the hechsher on the packaging. And some things – like coffee - never were in any packaging. For such things, you are now the Mashgiach. It is your responsibility to make sure it is acceptable. People might say: “What could be wrong with plain juice?” But it could contain grape juice. In Starbucks, they have a product called “refreshers” which has a high percentage of grape juice. So, is Starbucks kosher? No. Some branches may be less problematic than others but, in general, it cannot be said that Starbucks is kosher. If that Starbucks sells food, there will always be some form of cross contamination. People need to understand that kashrus is like allergens on steroids. If a person had a child with serious allergies, he would double and triple check every food item before bringing it into his home. He definitely would not eat in a restaurant before ensuring that everything was okay for his child. For some reason, people take a more relaxed approach when it comes to kashrus. There is no reason for that. Rabbi Hisiger: That’s a very good analogy. If people had the attitude that they might be “allergic” to Starbucks products and there might be severe ramifications, they wouldn’t just assume everything is fine. Rabbi Krems: If they serve food, it is a real restaurant. Most people would never walk into a non-kosher restaurant, even just to buy a drink. They should know that Starbucks that serve food are restaurants. Some Starbucks, however, are just coffee shops that sell only drinks and cold, packaged food. Those are not restaurants. Rabbi Hisiger: So is there anything that one can buy in Starbucks without worry? Rabbi Krems: It depends on the Starbucks. If they are just getting hot water from the tap and putting in a tea bag and the equipment isn’t used for anything else, it would not be a problem. Sometimes items are more acceptable and sometimes less. One should discuss the matter with his own Rov to obtain guidance on how to deal with that. The same is true about gas stations. If they have hot items, it can potentially be a problem. If someone is not makpid on cholov Yisroel and wants to buy an ice cream, it wouldn’t be as big of a problem because everything is cold. But what if he wants toppings? He may see the label on the box, but who says the toppings came in that box. If you are makpid on cholov Yisroel, the milk in a gas station may lose that status once the container is opened. There are gas stations all along Rte. 95 where they sell coffee and have cholov Yisroel milk in open containers. In a gas station or 7-11 one may assume the coffee is okay, but an unsealed container of milk may be a problem. Some Poskim are lenient about this and say that if there are a whole bunch of cholov Yisroel milk bottles in the gas station, there is no concern that they’ll switch it for other milk, but others are machmir about this. One should speak to his personal Rov to obtain guidance on when it is appropriate to rely on the leniency. In my opinion, one definitely shouldn’t rely on it when he’s at home and the only question is if he can rely on it when is traveling and needs to stay awake. Rabbi Hisiger: What about cold drinks like soda and Slurpees? Rabbi Krems: You can drink them if you know what they are. When one is at home, he is familiar with what he does and doesn’t drink. Once he leaves his comfort zone, he doesn’t necessarily have the same familiarity with the items he is using – so, he has to verify what it is. One might think the orange juice he sees is freshly squeezed when in actuality it is made from a syrup that is bona fide non-kosher. Many of the Slurpees in 7-11 are on a list of approved drinks but one cannot assume that until he verifies. Just because one flavor in a machine is kosher doesn’t mean all the others are and different flavors can look very similar. Pringles in the U.S. are known to be kosher but they aren’t in other countries. Some cereals in the U.S. are pareve but the exact same brand is dairy in other countries and completely treif in yet others. One has to do his research to make sure he knows what he is looking at. Doing research on these things and making sure that you know that what you’re looking at is what you’re getting is key number 1. When you see a juice, how do you know what it is? Because “Mohammad”, as we said before, told you it’s Kosher? That doesn’t work. You see that it’s squeezed in front of you, the keilim are clean, everything is cold, and it’s pure orange juice, then that’s fine.

Join Rabbi Zalman Krems, Rabbinical Coordinator of KVH-Rabbinical Council of New England and Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger, as they discuss what the traveler on the go needs to know about keeping kosher while on the road, in a wide-ranging conversation covering many food products that a traveling Jew may encounter from fish to nuts. Part 2 Rabbi Hisiger: What about baked items? Rabbi Krems: Baked items are another area of confusion for many people. Chazal tell us that there is a gezeirah of Pas Yisroel, that a Jewish person must have some involvement in the baking process but they add that one can be lenient and eat Pas Palter in some situations. This leads some people to think they can eat bread anywhere when they travel. But that is only true if they know that the ingredients and that the equipment hasn’t been compromised. Sometimes, the bread is baked in treif equipment. In some countries, they use lard in the bread. We know that most countries don’t use lard but one still has to make sure that they only use the basic ingredients: flour, sugar and water. Anything beyond that could be a problem. Rabbi Hisiger: Can one go into a store and buy a closed bottle of beer or whiskey? Rabbi Krems: The same rules apply. One has to know what the item is. In Scotland, they have relatively tight laws on how whiskey can be made, so we know that Scotch whiskey does not pose a serious kashrus concern. While there is the well-known question of the sherry casks, we won’t get into that today. If that issue is taken care of, whiskey has a chezkas kashrus. Beer, on the other hand, is more complicated. While the Shulchan Aruch says that beer is always kosher, in the 21st century it has become a lot more complicated than that. Many companies today are making craft beers that contain different ingredients and flavorings and they are not beholden to any real standards. Micro breweries are without a question a problem. Most kashrus companies say that you can still drink plain beer from a large reputable company and assume it is kosher, but as time progresses that could change. Belgium and Germany are countries of beer purists and they stick to the original ways of making beer but internationally there are beer companies doing anything and everything to enhance their beer. Rabbi Hisiger: What about fish? If one knows the simanim, can he buy fish anywhere? Rabbi Krems: This question usually comes from people who are in-town and are used to purchasing fish with a hechsher. Those who live out-of-town, who don’t have access to kosher fish shops, usually know the guidelines, which are actually quite simple. If you can see the skin of the fish with the scales on it, the fish is kosher. The only question is how it was cut and whether the residue of a non-kosher fish could have gotten on it. Even if the store shares equipment for kosher and non-kosher fish, it is cold, so it is an issue that can be dealt with. Duchka d’sakina is an issue, so you’d have to make sure that the knife was rinsed before the kosher fish was cut. Some people are machmir to scrape away a bit more afterwards. The cutting board also needs to be clean to get rid of the residue of other fish. This can be achieved by placing a piece of butcher paper on it. Rabbi Hisiger: What if you can’t see the scales but they tell you what type of fish it is? Rabbi Krems: That means absolutely nothing. You need to see the scales. There is a machlokes if the scales were taken off but you can see on the skin the space where the scales used to be. Most Poskim say that’s okay but Rav Nissim Karelitz held that it is not. Rabbi Hisiger: Is frozen fish any different? Rabbi Krems: Any time you purchase processed items you are running the risk that other things were mixed in that are not necessarily on the label. It’s better to use fresh fish if you have that option. If you have no other choice, and there is nothing else listed on the label, you can use frozen fish. Rabbi Hisiger: What are the guidelines for eating meat while on the road? Rabbi Krems: Meat obviously needs a hashgacha. Shechitah is highly complicated and one has to make sure it meets his standards. If the package says that it is kosher and it is properly sealed with two chosamos, it would be fine but it is not recommended to eat any meat unless you know it is coming from a reliable place. Rabbi Hisiger: Are there any items one comes across while traveling that don’t need a hashgacha? Rabbi Krems: The rule of thumb is that anything raw, like fruits and vegetables that don’t have bug problems, are okay. Anything beyond that is very geographic in nature. In some countries, dry roasted nuts are fine and contain no concerns. In others, they process them on the same line as nuts with oil, which obviously does need a hechsher. Processing other nuts on the same line will mess up the entire production from a kashrus standpoint. Rabbi Hisiger: Which is an important thing that you are mentioning. That even if someone is knowledgeable enough to read the ingredient list on the label, they don’t know the equipment that it was made on. Rabbi Krems: And you also don’t know if they used processing agents, there can be many problems in processing. Maple syrup, for example, is assumed to be kosher, but they have to use antifoam to make it, which can be treif. Traditionally they used to use a piece of bacon to stop the foam from flowing over. Rabbi Hisiger: I remember my father once told me that there are problems with release agents as well. Rabbi Krems: Right. Candies could be made in molds that need release agents to get them not to stick to the machinery that could be treif. People don’t understand why there are limited amounts of gummy bears and other gummy products, and the reason is very simple. All those things are created in molds that are made from starch, and they reuse the starch, and a lot of that starch is treif. So it isn’t so simple to come in and just kasher the whole factory. So like we said before, if someone would be allergic to something there, they would never dream of touching it. Rabbi Hisiger: This was a fascinating conversation. Thank you for all of the tips. Can you leave us with a Let’s Talk Kashrus takeaway for our viewers? Rabbi Krems: The takeaway should be that if you’re going on vacation to another city that is out of your comfort zone, you should do your research beforehand by speaking to a Rov and finding out what available products meet your standard. You have to do your own research even if you walk into a restaurant in your own area, as well as on the road. Speak to the Mashgiach. Ask questions. That’s the best thing. It strengthens kashrus and strengthens your own awareness, you may find out things that you ever even knew. If you’re traveling somewhere, in Europe and other parts of the world, or even in out of town communities in America, there are lists that can be found of what products you can buy without a hashgacha. This list will change from one place to another. The bottom line is: Be prepared and be an informed kosher consumer. Rabbi Hisiger: Thank you Rabbi Krems. Rabbi Krems: It was my pleasure.

Join Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger and Rabbi Moshe Elefant, Chief Operating Officer of OU Kosher, as they discuss the kashrus ramifications of meals served on flights and whether the food in first-class and economy are always the same kashrus-wise. Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger: One of our readers submitted an interesting question. It is very common for people who travel by plane to order a kosher meal. When the meal comes to their seat, the packaging is imprinted with a kosher certification to indicate that the food is kosher. Does that designation also certify that the meal was prepared in a kosher way? Can one rely on the hechsher on the packaging to assume there are no kashrus problems and he may eat the meal? Rabbi Moshe Elefant: That is an important question that involves many aspects and layers. For those, like me, who travel economy class, there is not much room for a question because the meal arrives double-wrapped. It was packaged this way, warmed up on the plane in the double-wrapping and served with only disposable plates and utensils. The only real problem a passenger would have, would be how to neatly open the packaging without making a mess. From a halachic perspective, however, everything is fantastic. Some people, however, are lucky enough to travel business or first-class. In those sections of the plane, passengers are given much more sophisticated, high-end service. While the meal arrives on the plane double-wrapped, it may be served to them unwrapped, on real dishes and with real silverware. In addition to the problems of the unknown kashrus status of the dishes and utensils, this could create problems of “basar shenisalem min ha’ayin” because you don’t know what was done to the meat before it was served to you. Moreover, the oven it was warmed up in is not kosher. If the meal was not double-wrapped when it was put in the oven, its kashrus status is compromised. In this regard, there is a big difference between El Al and other airlines. Rabbi Hisiger: In what way is El Al different from other airlines? Rabbi Elefant: On any airline, those who travel business or first-class are usually not served on disposable plates or with disposable silverware; however, on most airlines, the dishes and silverware used for the kosher meals are only used once for this purpose and subsequently are used for non-kosher meals. In other words, the kosher caterer is always given brand-new dishes to use for the kosher meals. This isn’t that big of an expense for the airline because they don’t have that many kosher-eating passengers and they are anyway constantly purchasing new dishes and silverware to replenish their stock; therefore, it isn’t too hard for them to give new dishes for kosher meals. El Al, on the other hand, has a much different situation because every meal on the plane is kosher and they reuse the same dishes and silverware. For this reason, the O.U. only certifies the El Al commissaries that prepare the meals for flights out of New York and Los Angeles. We do not certify the dishes used in business and first-class on those flights because those dishes travel around the world with El Al and are used for food from commissaries around the world. We would only be comfortable certifying food served on those dishes if we would be certifying all of the kitchens that food is made in – and we do not certify all of those kitchens. We, therefore, cannot take responsibility for that service. If someone wants to be confident about the kashrus of the meal while traveling with El Al on business or first-class, he would have to order the Mehadrin meal because we do take responsibility for those meals – not just for the food but for the service as well. Rabbi Hisiger: How are you able to take responsibility for the El Al Mehadrin meals? Rabbi Elefant: The Mehadrin meals are always double-wrapped. They also are served either on disposable dishes or on new non-disposable dishes, which are only used one for Mehadrin meals. Travelers also have to keep in mind that although the meals they get on El Al planes from the U.S. to Israel are always glatt, the meal you get on flights from to Israel to the U.S. are not necessarily glatt. Many times, I have seen people who are the type who want to only eat glatt kosher eating the meals on the flights from Israel because they assume that it must be glatt because it is produced in Israel. That is not always true. Furthermore, the fruits and vegetables are not necessarily on the standard everyone would want in regards to mitzvos hateluyos ba’aretz. I can describe one final potential issue with El Al’s business or first class with a story: I was in Eretz Yisroel and I went to daven at the Kosel. While I was there, a former talmid of mine came over and he looked like he was very angry with me. When I asked him what’s wrong, he said that he had just arrived that morning and had traveled business class. On the plane, they served him wine, which he drank. He later discovered that the wine was not mevushal and it was served by either a non-Jewish or non-religious stewardess. I’m not sure why he blamed me for that – but, I guess everything is the Mashgiach’s fault in the world of kashrus. In any event, people have to keep in mind that even on El Al, there might be an issue of stam yainam. Everyone is aware that the wine may be an issue on non-Jewish airlines, but people also have to be aware that they have to be careful about this on El Al as well. Rabbi Hisiger: Rabbi Elefant, thank you for clarifying these important issues and thank you for all you’ve done in the world of kashrus. ____ The views and opinions expressed in this program are those of the presenters & authors and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of other halachic opinions or the entities they represent. The mission of the Kashrus Awareness Project is to inform and educate the kosher consumer to know what to look out for and what to inquire about. The Kashrus Awareness Campaign receives guidance from AKO, an umbrella association of kashrus organizations. For all questions you have regarding halacha, please consult with your own morei derech. We recommend our readers to double check and seek out the latest information available.

Gilyon 3 - Cold Drinks on a Hot Summer Day Hot topics: Smoothies, Slurpies, and Refreshers Food for thought! Here's something to spark a Torah'dige conversation with your family. Make it part of your table talk.

The hot summer days bring with them all sorts of exciting refreshing drinks… and a plethora of contemporary halachic concerns. A little bit of education can go a long way in ensuring the kashrus of your next Starbucks coffee run. The following is a loose transcription of an insightful conversation between Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger and Rabbi Sholem Fishbane, Director of Kashrus for the Chicago Rabbinical Council, and the Executive Director of AKO. Enjoy the Q&A in which they discuss a rather un-refreshing discovery. Rabbi Yitzchok Hisiger: Thank you Rabbi Fishbane for joining us again. Another popular topic is refreshers in Starbucks. Yes, no, maybe? What's the story? Rabbi Sholem Fishbane: So, believe it or not, refreshers mean a lot of things. There's not one answer that all refreshers are off the table. But, the more popular ones are actually problematic, and I'll tell you a story. A couple months back, one of my cousins texted me, "Are Starbucks refreshers kosher?" I wrote back, "No." She wrote back, "Well, my friends are all drinking it." I typed back, "It's still not kosher." She asks, "Why not?" I wrote back, "Because it has white grape juice concentrate." Her next response jolted me, it was a good wake up call, she wrote back, "What's wrong with that?" I was so stunned! Because you know how it is when you're in an industry and you take for granted that everybody else is familiar with the things that you are? If you're in computers, you assume that surely everybody else knows what a motherboard is. So I explained to her the concept of stam yeinam that pertains to grape juice and Baruch Hashem, she and her friends switched their “Refreshers” to something halachically more refreshing. But, I started asking around, and I found that so many of our Bais Yaakov girls and our Yeshiva graduates didn't know that grape juice is a highly sensitive Kashrus ingredient. It is used widely in many products, especially in products that producers are trying to lower the sugar content. In cookies for example, they'll throw it in because it gives it some sweetness; my inquiries revealed to me that the oilem just didn't know it was non-kosher. The white grape juice concentrate is part of the drink’s base, you won’t see it of course, but it’s there. It can also show up in Starbucks’ lemonade. Rabbi Hisiger: You won’t see anyone squeezing grapes in the store. Rabbi Sholem Fishbane: Exactly, but since we know what the ingredients are, we’re familiar with the issue and it’s something people are simply not aware of. I have had many instances where I walked into a Starbucks and saw unzere menschen having that and I’d go over to them and tell them, "Listen, I don't like to intrude, but I must tell you that this drink is not kosher." And they’re shocked. I will also tell you, one of the things that they'll throw into a refresher many times is a cut lime or lemon. Since it's a davar charif, (‘a sharp item’) it has to be under supervision. A davar charif cut with a knife that's not kosher, becomes non-kosher. Rabbi Hisiger: That touches upon the whole Starbucks keilim issue, pertaining to the utensils being used behind the counter. Rabbi Fishbane: Oh, It's a whole other topic, we could be here for hours to talk about that… While there’s much to be enjoyed at Starbucks for the kosher consumer, there are also a host of other issues to be aware of, many of which are really major problems. I’ll add another thing. It’s also a different topic but since you mentioned squeezing grape juice, it brought to mind another important issue. You know, sometimes you go into these supermarkets and they'll prepare a freshly squeezed fruit drink for you? They'll take the orange, a pineapple or whatever and that can possibly be fine. However, if they're also adding grapes to the mix, and they're making juice for you, that's actually stam yeinam right in front of their eyes! You’d think it's fresh, what can be wrong? Rabbi Hisiger: So, limaaseh, stay away from refreshers? Rabbi Fishbane: Yes, and also understand why. We need education about what goes into our foods. Just because you see that someone else is drinking it, doesn’t give it a stamp of approval. People are pashut unaware of the issues. I mentioned the story to a friend of mine, and he says, "Oh my, I drink that! Whenever my wife goes to a Starbucks I ask her to bring one home too." His wife was also shocked. She said, "I didn't know! All my friends have been drinking it." So, association and thinking that because other people are enjoying something it’s automatically kosher. That's one of the problems that we're trying to tackle, and R’ Yitzcok, thanks to you for bringing awareness. People have to understand what it is that goes on behind the scenes, and then they’ll have a different mehalech, a different outlook, and hopefully we'll all keep a higher level of Kashrus. Yitzchok Hisiger: We want to help the consumer become “an educated consumer”. Rabbi Fishbane thank you for enlightening us. Rabbi Fishbane: Thank you. ____ The views and opinions expressed in this program are those of the presenters & authors and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of other halachic opinions or the entities they represent. The mission of the Kashrus Awareness Project is to inform and educate the kosher consumer to know what to look out for and what to inquire about. The Kashrus Awareness Campaign receives guidance from AKO, an umbrella association of kashrus organizations. For all questions you have regarding halacha, please consult with your own morei derech. We recommend our readers to double check and seek out the latest information available.